trial - designer mode - export design

[completerookie]

Have I missed something ,
in the designer mode, you can act as the designer and create new layouts etc and then update clients machines with the new design.

How the heck do you actually do the TWO process (download from designer
and upload to client)

[pinbrook]

export design snapshot , import to client

[completerookie]

I'm in designer trial v8.0.3 , and all I get is the following options

• catalog
• customer accounts
• shipping tables

how can we trial the whole concept of designer if the very idea is then missing

[cdicken]

You can use either 'File | Snapshot | Export Site' or 'Design | Deploy Site Snapshot' to pass an entire site to a customer. You can also use 'Design | Deploy Partial Site Design' to handover specific design elements.

[completerookie]

I've tried the 'File | Snapshot | Export Site' seems to include ALL of the site - not really what the designer is trying to do so it doesn't seem applicable in this circumstance.

according to the 'Design | Deploy Site Snapshot' will backup the following files:

The site backup consists of the following:-
1)All external files referenced in the site's design.
2) All files defined in the database 'FileList' and 'Additional Files' tables.
3) The site and shipping database files (ActinicCatalog.mdb and SimpleShipping.mdb)
4) The site registry entries.

so the question arises "if we export ActinicCatalog.mdb and SimpleShipping.mdb" what actual actions happen on the clients machine.
and what registry entries get transferred?

I just need to fully understand the process, what actually is being updated.

[cdicken]

It's 'Design | Deploy Partial Site Design' which is the one you want. This allows you to just transfer design elements to a client - without affecting their products.

[completerookie]

I've been busy with the deployment of the site design, - a couple of questions.

part way through, I'm being asked for "additional files" - why doesn't the system automatically include the list of files I've already entered

at the moment, I've only got a few files in the "additional files" list, but as time grows, it means I've got to make a note of all the files there to make sure I include them in the deployment. - if they were defaulted, then I could always hit the delete button - alternatively, offer a button to import the list of additional files from the main system.

Why are some of the layouts, conditions, variables etc in bold

When it comes to choosing which items need to be included, nearly all the layouts are ticked but some are in bold - whats the significance

Is there any way we can (automatically?) identify which files, layouts etc need to be included in this deployment

I've been updating databases for the last 20+ years and the hardest thing to ensure is forcing all the neccessary files as part of the upgrade process.
In the past, with other programmes, I've been able to create a "site list" and then tick a box to say "from now on, any item I alter needs to be automatically included in the next deployment for THAT site list" - naturally, there needs to be a simple flag that gets set/reset to make this work, but not difficult to implement., also need a choice of sites.

We only get the option to add "product name", splash bitmap and designer url when we give an ENTIRE deployment

As a "designer" (or potential designer) it would be nice to splash our name over any of the updates to inform the client what you're doing for them. - Why not offer these options on the partial deployment making it more "professional"

[completerookie]

Last posting, I had created the deployment file, now I've had a chance to re-instate the OLD original snapshot that I created when I first installed actinic so I have all the original settings.
the snapshot came from Chris's advice "It's 'Design | Deploy Partial Site Design' which is the one you want. This allows you to just transfer design elements to a client - without affecting their products." - from an earlier posting.

Lets suppose the following:
I am "the designer" creating a new layout for my client and my client's office is 200 miles away
The client is already on v8 (making life very easy) and wants that new look and feel on their site so all I have to do is take the deployed snapshot and show them how to implement my design. They already have 2000 products, + orders . . .

Problems
1st think I encounter is that all the list of files that I've added to the additional files is NOT copied with the deployment - I've forgotten to take note, I'm a novice and this is my first upgrade. ! - These files are needed to make the upgrade to the website work and that WILL be the clients responsibily when I leave their office.

Next problem:
I need to take a complete copy of the settings I've altered - settings | Site Options - because the deployment doesn't copy those either. - things like the navigation layout - a new fancy expanding thing-a-ma-jig , the width of the product layout etc. all of the other layout settings.
If I miss any one of these settings, the system doesn't work.

Next: My new fancy layout contains background gifs, lots of them, they are automatically copied on to the trial web-site but NOT automatically copied with the deployed layouts (not even if I've included them in the list of additional files) - more files I should have take note of before I drove 200 miles.

I've already listed just THREE of the problems with the deployment, I'm 200 miles away, not looking very professional, not very happy. (in reality I'm working on my own machine at home so things aren't 200 miles away)

I CANNOT create a FULL deployment and have everything going over to the client, they've already got products and I can't upset those. (or can I? - see last paragraph)

I'm already woried in case files are in the "correct place on my pseudo clients machine" because they are part of my "master design machine" but in real life, I would have forgotten to take those files with me.

This "deployment of a site layout" needs a "checklist", a much much better help text, more automatic inclusions etc.

does anyone else have notes of other things that needs to be remembered / included / noted etc to make a partion layout deployment work - I'm playing it by ear at the moment, but I'm having to take snapshots of the "clients machine" and re-instate my "master design", make notes of problems, reinstate "clients machine" make a fix, find another problem, take another snapshot etc. etc etc - You get the picture.

no doubt someone's going to jump in and say "you should have clicked on this little tick box and all would have been done for you - if this is the case, please say so, I'd be more than happy with the clue

One other potential solution - not YET experimented with -
On the Master-Designers machine, create a FULL deployment snapshot
on the CLIENTS machine, do a Data-Export (all three options)
On the CLIENTS machine, do a FULL INPORT of the deployed snapshot
On the CLIENTS machine, restore the Data from the Export.

I will persevere !

[completerookie]

One other potential solution - not YET experimented with -
On the Master-Designers machine, create a FULL deployment snapshot
on the CLIENTS machine, do a Data-Export (all three options)
On the CLIENTS machine, do a FULL INPORT of the deployed snapshot
On the CLIENTS machine, restore the Data from the Export.

nope, doesn't work, - I tried it, but of course, I lost all those important settings like "business settings" etc

so - back to the drawing board !

[cdicken]

I agree that the ''Deploy Partial Site Design' feature isn't a brilliant way to transfer a full design to a client. It's very good for sending the customer the occasional updated layout, but not brilliant when you've got the send the customer a whole selection of new layouts.

Here are some tips:

1) If you are sending the customer a completely updated design, the best thing to do is probably when you are ready to hand over the design, get the customer to send you an export of their catalog (File | Export). You can then import this into your copy and then send them a whole site snapshot - this will ensure that all the required files are sent.

2) Test, test and test again. When I need to send a snapshot to a customer, I always license a new site on my Designer/MultiSite and use that to import the snapshot just so I know exactly what the customer is going to be be sent.

3) If you are sending a partial site design, it's fairly obvious how to select the correct layouts to include in the snapshot. What isn't obvious is that if you want to send a customer a 'setting' (such as a selected navigation bar in 'Settings | Site Options' ) you need to send them the 'layout selector' as well as the layout. This ensures the customer gets sent the correct setting. To find out the layout selectors you need to send, click in a setting in Site Options, and look at the 'Variable name is...' text at the bottom. This is the name of the layout selector you need to send the customer. They are shown in bold in the second panel of the partial site design wizard.

4) Alternatively, you might consider forgetting about 'Settings | Site Options' and instead use 'Fixed Layouts' in your design to ensure the correct layout is used. To set a fixed layout in your design, find the pink layout selector in the layout code that inserts the thing you are insterested in. Then right-click on it and select 'Edit Appearance'. In the 'Use Fixed Layout?' field set the layout you want to use.

This way, you always know the correct layout is going to be used by Actinic, no matter what is set in 'Settings | Site Options'.

Hope this gives you some useful pointers.

1st think I encounter is that all the list of files that I've added to the additional files is NOT copied with the deployment - I've forgotten to take note, I'm a novice and this is my first upgrade. ! - These files are needed to make the upgrade to the website work and that WILL be the clients responsibily when I leave their office.

I think this is a fantastic idea. I'll pass it onto the team.

[pinbrook]

I agree that the ''Deploy Partial Site Design' feature isn't a brilliant way to transfer a full design to a client. It's very good for sending the customer the occasional updated layout, but not brilliant when you've got the send the customer a whole selection of new layouts.

Yuk!!!!

Can I request the design snapshot feature is improved, as this is going to be a real issue for designers. I agree we can reverse the process and get the export from the client but isn't that somewhat defeating the object of having a design snapshot.

I have to admit I am working on a site at the mo for which i used my previous v8 site as the design master. I was faced with the option of using design snapshot to bring the design into a new site. I copped out as I was aware of postings discussing design snapshot.

I chose to create new site, import full snapshot from previously V8 designed site, create another new site in designer , export hierarcical data, to get clean actinic products so I could develop the newsite using a small subset of product rather than the full product set from the live v6 site. Abit of a bodge but it worked. My only outstanding issue will be to get the product data from v6 to v8 when the time comes. Another reason for holding back on importing current v6 data is the products on the live site will change alot over the next few weeks - this method prevents duplicate product input.

[completerookie]

thanks for the update Chris, but I have to agree with Jo.

Actinic has split the products down into standalone catalog and business OR designer (with catalog or business) but and its a big but, a lot of this release has been aimed at making the product more customisable (ie the designer in mind)
If we can't design a new site and EASILY transfer the design (WITHOUT problems) to the client, then we are wasting our time. - hence my questions.

Jo is also right when it comes to setting up web-site number two (and 3 and 4 . . . ), we need to be able to re-use the existing code and layouts that we've already built WITHOUT re-inventing the wheel.

although its a good start, its clearly "work in progress" and you need to get a LOT more input from "designers"

I like the hints you've given, but I'm not sure that its enough to make my life easy.

Getting a copy of their catalog, updating it and returning it as a snapshot isn't going to work, Life carries on, they want to be able to download orders while the snapshot is being built.

the use of "'Use Fixed Layout" is a good idea, BUT WHY ISN'T IT DOCUMENTED MORE ! - Make the designers life EASIER, don't make us look for everything.

If you are talking to the actinic team, get them to make a button to create a list of the SETTINGS that they need to make their new website work - I've currently got to make lots of independand notes.

Can you tell us which table the settings are store in, at least I can then write a quick ms-access prog to generate a quickie list of settings.

[cdicken]

Getting a copy of their catalog, updating it and returning it as a snapshot isn't going to work, Life carries on, they want to be able to download orders while the snapshot is being built.

That's fine though. When your client imports the snapshot, they can choose to not overwrite their orders.

the use of "'Use Fixed Layout" is a good idea, BUT WHY ISN'T IT DOCUMENTED MORE ! - Make the designers life EASIER, don't make us look for everything.

When we first started documenting the design features of v8, we only had a vague idea about how people were going to use the features, and which features would prove the most popular - and the most troublesome. Having said all that, however, fixed layouts are covered on p82 of the Getting Started Guide - in a section called 'Inserting Layouts Into The Design'.

Can you tell us which table the settings are store in, at least I can then write a quick ms-access prog to generate a quickie list of settings.

The variables and layout selectors themselves are stored in the 'Variables' table. All the settings for the variables (in 'Site Options' etc.) are stored in the 'UserDefineProperties' table.

[completerookie]

many thanks Chris, will continue to snoop and play.