csv import and export issues

[gabrielcrowe]

had anyone any insight on how the csv import works?

i can sucessfully import a csv with products with minimal data, such as price and names/details... but i'm assuming that i can build an entire catalog out of a csv.

the reason i say this is that our products are held in an awkward database, that i can output csv, in any format.

i have managed to get this to work and my database sucessfully sicks out products. these are then saved as csv, and imported and I can build the html happily. but i'm missing a _lot_ of fields, and things such as size and colour option form items, including some key layout items, and some structures i dont understand.

i output a csv from actinic itself, to investigate the format, to mimic it, but its hideously complex!!

i'll happily write a set of programs to edit this csv, or give out my database and asp to anyone that helps me to solve this daft output. so that they can build squillions of products too.

thanks for the help in advance ;o)

- Gabriel

[Jan]

There are two types of import for products, flat file and hierarchical, the outpt you are seeing from Actinic is hierarchical.

If you look at the help files and search for "How does importing work?" there is a section that explains how the flat file import works.

Regards,

[NormanRouxel]

Actinic allows you to have products with an arbitrary number of Attributes (e.g. Colour, Size, etc), Components (e.g. Gift wrapping - extra £3), Custom Properties (e.g. #bedrooms, #bathrooms, etc).

There's no way this can be accommodated in a single line flat-file type import. So, in order to allow a catalog to be created from external data, the very powerful Hierarchical Import is available.

However if you only sell very simple products with just 1 price and no choices, etc, then you could use the Flat File import.

Creating a complex catalog from scratch using a program generated hierarchical file isn't unbearably complex.

I've done this to enable a site to be built from an external EPOS system, whereby the entire site structure comes from foreign database that was never structured with exporting in mind. We can start with a completely blank product tree and after a single hierarchical import have a fully populated website that needs no manual tweaking before publishing.

[EaglesNest]

Actinic allows you to have products with an arbitrary number of Attributes (e.g. Colour, Size, etc), Components (e.g. Gift wrapping - extra £3), Custom Properties (e.g. #bedrooms, #bathrooms, etc)...

...Creating a complex catalog from scratch using a program generated hierarchical file isn't unbearably complex.

Norm,

Is there a program available that will take a csv and convert it to a Hierarchical format to import to actinic. I have about 3000 products that all have attributes, colors, sizes, etc.

Thanks
Eagle

[webyourbusiness]

Is there a program available that will take a csv and convert it to a Hierarchical format to import to actinic. I have about 3000 products that all have attributes, colors, sizes, etc.

I wish. Hierarchical is EXTREMELY complex - I don't think a single program could be written - if you understand awk or nawk, you could write a script to handly it....

[NormanRouxel]

My EPOS integration software is a single program that writes a Hierarchical file that completely defines the entire product tree with attributes, choices, components, etc. Mind you, it is now over 17,000 lines of Delphi (it does a few other things as well).

For most products the hierarchical file looks pretty similar to the flat-file one. The main difference is that the Section structure is defined separately, before the products that go into that section.

Also Attributes are quite easy to add if you've a bit of programming skill. Basically, once you've written the Product line, you write an Attribute tag, that names the attribute, followed by an arbitrary number of choice lines that name the choices. Then another Attribute (if required) followed by its choices, etc.

[EaglesNest]

My EPOS integration software is a single program that writes a Hierarchical file that completely defines the entire product tree with attributes, choices, components, etc. ...

Thanks Norm, which program is that. I was looking at your site and couldn't quite figure out which one. The one that I am thinking it might be was NorCat, am I correct in that assumption? I am reading about NorCat and it says that it works with the Top2Toe EPOS, will it also work with just a plain CSV that I get from my vendor?


Thanks
Eagle

[Jan]

We have written several program to produce hierarchical programs from flat files, they are not that complex, as Norman has said. Every one is different though because the input is different, so it is not the sort of product that you can sell off the shelf.

Regards,

[EaglesNest]

We have written several program to produce hierarchical programs from flat files, they are not that complex, as Norman has said. Every one is different though because the input is different, so it is not the sort of product that you can sell off the shelf.

Regards,

Hi Jan,

Thank you very much for the reply. What about writing one that has some sort of mapping routine built in.

1) READ THE CSV with headers.
2) RUN A MAPPING ROUTINE
3) SAVE THE MAP
4) WRITE OUT THE HIERARCHICAL

My guess is that the hardest part would be writing the mapping routine.

If I send you a copy of the csv, could you take a look at it and let me know how hard it would be to create the hierarchical file?

Thanks
Eagle

[NormanRouxel]

Norcat reads the Top 2 Toe database, not a CSV file. As Jan has said, it's highly unlikely that there will ever be an "off the shelf" solution to creating hierarchical files from unspecified user data.

The most obvious problem is how do you deal with colour / size type entities where there can be an arbitrary number of such items per product.

Unless your CSV is using a record for each combination (leading to lots of near-duplicate records), there's no simple way to hold an arbitrary amount of information within a fixed field count structure.

[EaglesNest]

Norcat reads the Top 2 Toe database, not a CSV file. As Jan has said, it's highly unlikely that there will ever be an "off the shelf" solution to creating hierarchical files from unspecified user data.

The most obvious problem is how do you deal with colour / size type entities where there can be an arbitrary number of such items per product.

Unless your CSV is using a record for each combination (leading to lots of near-duplicate records), there's no simple way to hold an arbitrary amount of information within a fixed field count structure.

Then what am I left with? Doing it by hand using ExCel to manipulate the data from csv to hierarchical writing a script or something?

Dumbfounded

Eagle

[webyourbusiness]

Then what am I left with? Doing it by hand using ExCel to manipulate the data from csv to hierarchical writing a script or something?

You got it.

[anf1y]

Coincidence or what? I thought I would try to solve an "oddity" with my site by exporting the site as csv and looking at the code. Did this and it wouldn't re-import! (and still haven't tracked down the problem - more in another thread when I've worked aout how to ask the question)
I then got curious about the Import/Export routine. I have NO problem with flat file import, but thought I should try to get to grips with heirarchical ones.
I have so far tried export as comma delimited and also as tab delimited. Then re-importing (as an update) without even OPENING the file. Both times I get a long error list! So, if Actinic doesn't even like its own generated file, what chance do I have of creating one? Seriously, is there something obvious like a box to tick?

[webyourbusiness]

Coincidence or what? I thought I would try to solve an "oddity" with my site by exporting the site as csv and looking at the code. Did this and it wouldn't re-import!

Ha! Fixed in 7.03 - an export to CSV will now re-import back into the system.. it was one of my biggest annoyances....

[anf1y]

Thanks for that. There's nothing worse than thinking "it must be me"!

Given that I received my copy of Catalog only yesterday, I (stupidly) thought I wouldn't need to do an update yet! Oh well, here goes!