Upgrading Actinic 5 to 6

[Jalz]

Hi Guys,
I'm a total newbie at the Actinic world so please be gentle. I'm about to start a job in two weeks and one of my tasks is to convert and existing Actinic 5.14 site into version 6 (I'll upgrade him to v8 later once I've gained knowledge of Actinic). How big is the task, I believe you can export data out of v5 into v6, but how about all the layouts?

Bearing in mind I've never used Actinic, is this going to be a huge task? I think the product he currently owns is Catalogue.

Cheers

Jalz

[pinbrook]

You may want to consider the big leap to 8, as 8 is very different to any prior version you will have to learn v6, then forget it all to go to 8.

V6 (and V7) are all about editting templates and manipulating Netquotevars, V8 chucks all of that out of the window.

[Jalz]

Hi Jo,

Thanks for this, as its my first computer support job - I dont want to sound pushy and get them to upgrade by spending money. Besides I'm in this for the long haul - so I when Im a little bit more aware of Actinic, and I dont have much to do in 6 months time, I can advise them to upgrade and go through the procedure again, but redesign the website.

My task in 2 weeks will be to 'migrate' the existing v5 layouts and data to v6 which they own but haven't used.

[wjcampbe]

It is not 'pushy' to be honest with a client/customer/employer - it is basic business ethics.

If the customer then still chooses to use v6, at least it is an informed decision.

If it is a full time employer, he might prefer to pay you once to learn the new, totally different version of the software, rather than pay for you to learn an outdated, soon to be unsupported version, and then pay again for the learning curve on the new.

You have nothing to lose by telling him, and a lot to lose if he reads this forum and discovers the truth for himself.

[Jalz]

Point Taken Bill,

I think I will do a "sales" pitch regarding v8. Im a dreamweaver developer, so I think I'd also win as v8 supports DW.

Off topic, the main reason he wants to upgrade is becasue at present any changes amends to the product have to go through the ISP thats hosting the site. Presumably Actinic v8 Catalogue would enable him to do this, or does he need to purchase additional modules to do this like the case with v5?

Cheers

[pinbrook]

Off topic, the main reason he wants to upgrade is becasue at present any changes amends to the product have to go through the ISP thats hosting the site. Presumably Actinic v8 Catalogue would enable him to do this, or does he need to purchase additional modules to do this like the case with v5?

You should find out exactly the arrangement he has with his previous supplier.

You can completey self manage within v5, there is no need to upgrade to do this. Unless you have to upgrade to get out of the current arrangement.

It may be that your employer only has order manager (if such a thing exsisted in v5), in fact I could speculate all day as to what your employer has.

I suugest you thoroughly investigate the situation, and then ask more Qs here.

[wjcampbe]

I think what you are saying is that he is currently running v5 in hosted mode (i.e. he bought from a reseller who provides hosting space and a copy of the software pre-set to use that space) and now he wants to re-launch his site on his own webspace.

Yes v8 will allow upload to own webspace, it's just a case of getting the network settings right.

[Jalz]

I've just had a word with my new boss - as i'm worried about this Actnic project. He has said he is willing to upgrade to v8 providing the box doesn't sit on the shelf and its going to be worth his while by doing the things that he has requested.

Can I download the trial version as I'm twiddling my thumbs and see how easy it is to import data and make changes to the layouts. I can probably get ftp details of the 'live' store. What would I use to download this (can I use cuteftp or does actinic have its own ftp client?)

Jo, he is not sure what contract they have with actinic and the supplier. He has purchased this company 3 months ago and basically at present wants to edit data which he cant do.

Sorry for questions, I think I'm preparing myself for the task ahead.

[pinbrook]

Ok you can download a trial version of v8 (30 days) you should be able to export the data from v5 to it.

I'd be inclined to only seek to bring product and order info into v8 and completely redesign the look of the site yourself.

You may need to renegotiate the webhosting contract with your host. If you have a hosted version you now need to move to indepentant webspace so you can completely self manage.

By buying V8 from Actinic you can cut out the host and move forwards on your own, if this is what you feel is best. Talk to Actinic sales as there are so good deals on buying V8 at present and you have an unused v6 to take into acct

[Jalz]

Thanks Jo,

I've spoken to the techies at Actinic, and they've told me to get a snapshot of the existing site, and import it into the the new site. This will take into account both layouts and data. The layouts may need to be tweaked based on how complex they were designed.

At present the boss just wants complete control over the site, as he can't add his own products or download orders etc to it. The main 'cosmetic' change he wants in the design is the telephone and address of the business.

My question is, if I can't get the ISP to give me a snapshot, can I create one myself? if I've got access to the ftp site? I know the site is running Actinic 5.1.4 - Surely there must be a way to do it?

I will talk about redesigning the site later, but at present he just wants to make minor adjustments (I personally quite like the look of the current site and I'm picky)

[pinbrook]

the only way to get a snapshot is from the ISP, the only thing you can get to via FTP is the completed HTML pages.

You could regenerate the product info from the the html but it would be arduous if you have a lot od products, so it would be better to establish a relationship with the isp with a view to getting the snapshot then seeing if you can continue the relationship with them with you managing the store and them simply hosting it.

If they won't allow you to self manage you will need to find a new host, after you have got the snapshot. You will need to continue to get them to host the hosted version whilst you redevelop the site

When I said redesign the site I didn't necessarily mean redesign it, i meant recode it in V8 to get rid of any legacy v5 code. Old Hands to Actinic tend to consider a recode is the best way forwards when upgrading between versions and when taking over a site from an unknown other. This way to get to create clean code with no black holes to fall into at a later date

[Jalz]

Hi Guys,

Ive managed to get a snapshot from the suppliers, and Ive downloaded the trial version of Actinic 8.

Im going to be attempting to see what happens if I import the snapshot.

Can any of you guys advise me of small of the pitfalls I may face whilst converting this old legacy version into the new one. If its just cosmetic I will use the html editor to restore it to its original database, but are there any known data conversion problems that anyone is aware of?

[pinbrook]

With 5 to 8 its a case of suck it and see.

Either report difficulties here to the forum or to actinic support

[cdicken]

There are two ways to upgrade from v5 to v8.

The first method is called an 'install upgrade'. This is when you install v8, and then during the installation you choose to upgrade your v5 site. This will upgrade your data and also upgrade your templates to the new v8 format.

You can actually run the v8 setup.exe file any time after you have installed v8, and you will be able to just pick a v5 site from your PC to pull into your v8 installation.

We've had varying degrees of success upgrading templates from before v6 into v8 so it may be better for you to switch to using v8 layouts rather than upgraded v5 templates once you are upgraded. You can do this by going to 'Settings | Site Options | Layouts' and changing the values of any of the layout fields there that have the word 'Upgraded' in them. You can just select an equivalent v8 layout from the list.

There is also an upgrade method called a 'database drop' - which is not officially supported by Actinic, and also doesn't handle custom properties, but it might work if you have a simple site with no custom properties defined:
- Install v8 and start it in order to create a 'Site1' site.
- Close v8
- Copy the 'ActinicCatalog.mdb' file from your v5 'Site1' folder into the v8 'Site1' folder.
- Copy 'SimpleShipping.mdb' from the 'Site1\ShipControl' folder in v5 into the 'Site1\ShipControl' folder in v8.
- Restart v8.

(If your v5 site is called something other than Site1, then make sure you copy the databases from that folder, rather than Site1)

This will start v8 with all your data and orders, but you will also have a clean set of layouts to customise - rather than working with upgraded v5 templates.

FYI - the option of importing a v5 snapshot into v8 is not available. This only works with v6 or higher.

[Jalz]

Hi Guys,

started my first day, and boy Actnic 8 wont import a snapshot from anything lower than v6.

I've had no choice but to import it in v6, but the layouts are messedup.How would I know where to look for a custom theme?